Landships II

Andrew Gorman · Corporal

Rock Island Arsenal Mk.VIII, Mk. V?, Ford 3ton and SPG pictures

Ironsides · Legend

Hi A Few Thoughts...
At first I thought the top picture is a of a St charmond or Schnieder self propelled gun however, I think its an american experimental prototype built using a altered holt chassis..the apparant size is probarbly deceptive....
The Renault behind this vehicle appears to be the same one in the side shot with the guy who looks like he owns it, this is an american built 6 Tonner not a renault�ft17...
This same man appears to feature in several of the other pictures, 2nd from right on top or in front of the MKVIII....
The tank 2nd from bottom is a MKV and has "Read em and Weep" written on the side..
The same house appears in the background of several of the pictures...these may be interconnected and taken on the same date, there may be some kind of exhibition going on..
These pictures all appear to be post War possibly even as late as the 1930s

Cheers

James H · Legend

That top pic appears to be the Self-Propelled Caterpillar Mk I mounting the British 8" Howitzer, three of which were built after the Armistice. It used the same engine as the Holt 10-ton Artillery Tractor discussed recently.

Centurion · Legend

The Mk V is likely to one of those brought back by the 301st in 1919

Ironsides · Legend

Hi James absolutly right heres a another pic Self-Propelled Caterpillar Mk I

A little info can be found here plus a number of other prototypes�look down the page, I missed it first time round..

http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/UnitedStates/selfpropelledguns/selfpropelledguns.html

Cheers

Gwyn Evans · Legend

Terrific photos - thanks for sharing them.

I believe this Mark V is a Male, number 9015 and also known as Baby Doll. As Centurion says it did belong to the 301st battalion. This tank seems to have travelled the States on war bond work. The words "Buy A Bond" can be seen painted on the gun shield (though partially obscured in this shot as the gun has been traversed). A photo of this tank taken in the same location was recently for sale on eBay. Photos of Baby Doll in Minneapolis in July 1919 can be found elsewhere on this forum - somewhere....

Gwyn

Ironsides · Legend

Hi Gwyn, I thought I'd seen "read em and weep" before.. couldnt remember where though...

Baby Doll "Read em and Weep" can be seen on this Brittania thread...

http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=63528&p=3&topicID=10796868

another pic here..

http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=63528&p=3&topicID=13418758

Cheers

James H · Legend

At first glance I thought the 6-tonner in the top pic was a TSF, but in the later pic it appears to be carrying some sort of placard or billboard attached to the turret. I can't read what it says, but there's a similar, legible�one on the Ford 3 Ton, as if the vehicles are taking part in some sort of�display or parade. The caterpillar-mounted howitzer was very rare, so what could this event have been? A private collection? An Army PR display?

Ironsides · Legend

Could some of these pictures be from the re-opening of the arsenal museum to the public in 1919? the picture of baby doll might indicate a 1919 date as it seems little different to the one posted on the brittania thread which is dated 26/7/19

http://www.riamwr.com/MuseumHist.htm

There appears to have been restriction on meetings due to the spanish flu outbreak in 1918 and early 1919.....

http://blogs.davenportlibrary.com/sc/?tag=rock-island-arsenal

Cheers

-- Edited by Ironsides at 10:05, 2008-11-19

Centurion · Legend

Ironsides wrote:

Could some of these pictures be from the re-opening of the arsenal museum to the public in 1919? the picture of baby doll might indicate a 1919 date as it seems little different to the one posted on the brittania thread which is dated 26/7/19

-- Edited by Ironsides at 10:05, 2008-11-19

Thats no way Baby Doll which was a Mk V and the tank in the link

you posted is a Mk V*

Gwyn Evans · Legend

Not sure I follow this last post. Which tank is a Mark V*?

Gwyn

Centurion · Legend

The last tank in the series of photos linked to in the first post of this thread.

Mark Hansen · Legend

Centurion wrote:

The last tank in the series of photos linked to in the first post of this thread.

No, that's definitely a Mk V. Check the rear roof position. It has a flat front and a top-hinged single side flap. The Mk V* had an angled front and two side flaps hinged at the front and rear. The tank itself is too short to be a Mk V*. The panel ahead of the vent comes almost all the way to the sponson. On the Mk V* it stops roughly 6 feet further aft.

James H · Legend

Is it possible that Cent has mistaken the open sponson door for the side door of the V*?

Andrew Gorman · Corporal

Thanks for all of the information!� The photos themselves seem to be in two groups, in two different sizes and paper.� Some are from some kind of event, with the tanks staged and sometimes with signs (the Ford, SPG, and the Mk. VIII in front of the brick warehouse).� The Mk.VIII pictures with crew and tree� are slightly different in size and paper, and� the guys in coveralls don't seem to be dressed for an open house.�� The Mk. V is also being gone over by workmen.� The picture of the "owner" of the 6 tonner is an 8X10, and there was a smaller print of the same picture in the lot.� Please keep the suggestions coming!� If any of the people or locations are identifiable I would really like to know.�

Ironsides · Legend

Hi All... here are some more pictures from the Minnesota Historical Society's archives.. which may be connected it seems that there was a large event there on the 26/7/19�this may have been�an event at Fort Snelling... Im posting all the pics for clarity...

Cheers